So, as this current storyline seems to be coming to a conclusion, how do people feel about the 'Get Ichigo's Powers Back' arc? Even though it feels extremely isolated from the rest of the series due to the lack of Soul Society involvement, I think it's gone quite well even if 90% of it about as inconsequential as can be. I'm a sucker for timeskips, silly comedy, weird powers and new fashion developments, though, and so I've enjoyed it (with the notable exception of the 'Yuzu wants to date her big brother' subplot which hopefully will never, ever be referred to again. Ugh).

The likelihood that Tsukishima, rather than being the usual rather uninteresting guest villain filler arcs always rely on, is covertly working with the other Fullbringers to give Ichigo an enemy to fight against and speed up the regeneration of his powers seems increasingly evident... thoughts?

What is up with those sibling complexes BTW?

The entire arc has felt like filler to me with new characters, unformed nebulous goals, and teasers of WHAT'S THAT OVER THERE? Things I've liked have included Orihime-chan's spine finally showing up on screen, Chad being bad ass and positively chatty, and Ishida being all  dramatic broody in a Sherlock-y sort of way. Lack of favorite character has been giving me grumpings. I do like Ichigo's new Ranger style skeleton inspired reaper suit.

Mostly I've been digging the fresh reset button and Ichigo's related angst but it seems like it is dragging. I'm hoping KT does his usual expand-o-plot reveal soon.

Things I've been waiting on include the conversation Ichigo overheard through his substitute badge of Rukia defending him from accusations of doing *something*. A thing that I suspect is related to fraternizing with these Fullbringers.  With their video games and their shouty shouty for realz killings.


Dear Best Dad in the World, I'm concerned that you are still making back room deals with the Dodgest Shopkeeper in the World. Can we get a step mom/dad plot online to keep this guy out of trouble already?

The thing that's giving this story its emotional edge is the devastated/broken state of Ichigo. It's showing what a wreck of a young man he's become, how utterly despondent and nihilistic Hueco Mundo and Aizen have left him. He can't trust Urahara or his father, his friends have deserted him, he barely knows or trusts Ginjou (whose allegiance Tsukishima will no doubt be removing shortly as the straw that breaks the camels back) and his first thought for fixing things is to kill Tsukishima. He's even OK with Ginjou framing it as murder. Even before this he barely went to work and was selling his sporting abilities to the highest bidder, barely seeming to care who that highest bidder was. Morally, spiritually, emotionally... Ichigo's fucked up. His life is a lie, he's in denial, he used even last ounce of himself against Aizen and somewhere, in the process of losing the plot and scoring his first ambiguous 'kill' he's been infected with Ulquiorra's emptiness/apathy. Watching him lunge for the slightest shred of power the Fullbringers could offer him was pathetic. The whole thing has a vaguely hallucinogenic feel, like Ichigo's been forced through unreal or farcical scenarios, like some kind of shonen version of Terry Gilliams' Brazil. Watching him freak out and blame Ginjou was almost too much; he's a shell of his former self.

Also, these chapters are continuing the tradition of re-examining the first fifty issues from a different perspective. First the we get the Shinigami perspective, then the Hollow, then more on Chad and Orihime, probably next time it'll be the Quincy/Ryuken/Ishida back story. Bleach is always about showing you that the first fifty issues weren't what you thought they were. If Tsukishima's power is what Ginjou suspects then it's a fun way of placing that continual retcon subtext into the main story, it's fairly self-referential from a certain angle.

"The whole thing has a vaguely hallucinogenic feel, like Ichigo's been
forced through unreal or farcical scenarios, like some kind of shonen
version of Terry Gilliams' Brazil."

(How do you do quotes on this thing?)

That's why I still think this storyline might be a dream sequence. My theory is that the final battle put Ichigo into some kind of coma and Dad and Urahara are trying to wake him up. He's working out his issues via his subconscious.

The only thing I see to refute that is the bits and pieces where the characters are interacting with each other and Ichigo's not around. But I've had stuff like that happen in dreams before, so who knows?

< select via high light the text you want to quote and behold! Tiny quote button automagically appears! Though on my phone I has to use old fashion ways. See following example. >

Seth:
"Ichigo's fucked up. His life is a lie, he's in denial, he used even last ounce of himself against Aizen and somewhere, in the process of losing the plot and scoring his first ambiguous 'kill' he's been infected with Ulquiorra's emptiness/apathy. Watching him lunge for the slightest shred of power the Fullbringers could offer him was pathetic."

Yes, his Fullbring smacks of grasping for something - anything - that can put him above human level of function. He's never been human though has he, and I think this lack of heart and frustration are about this. On one hand it makes me even more WTF about what his dad is up to with even trying to make him human. On the other it signals to me why Rukia is so strangely abscent ( not shipping rant intro, promise).

I find Seth's idea of reexaming the first fifty issues fascinating as here is our boy once again feeling alienated and powerless. However, this power he has been offered isn't yet borrowed to awaken his own. As far as we've seen the other Fullbring people haven't dumped on him (anyone else think that bill of sale sounds like beans for a cow or what?). This is him pulling it from his non humanness again.

I never understood the whole "We Fullbringers don't want our powers." They seem like pretty cool powers to me...and so far I haven't seen any drawbacks to having them.

I suppose it makes sense in a metaphoric/subconscious sort of way, with Ichigo being so uncomfortable with his own power, and being more than happy to get rid of it (initially, at least).

I think it's because Hollows are the source of the powers. The implication was that the powers were birthed in some kind of trauma, so if the exposition about wanting rid of them is true (and I'm not convinced it is) then I can understand it from that angle. As you say, the Vaizard and Ichigo have been in a similar position.

I'm hoping it isn't a dream or dismissed arc as Orihime's moment of kick ass was well worth a great deal of my annoyance with the pacing and intentional confusion going on.

So Ichigo's heroic making peace with giving up everything related to power to defeat Aizen was on some level untrue? Untrue in he's still got some sort of power and sure as hell isn't at peace with being the local rough?

Speaking of Vaizard, Ichigo's other allies are surprisingly absent, no?

The story does seem to be sailing worryingly close to the dream/simulation narrative chasm. There was Ichigo's dream in the first few chapters, everyone acting out of character this issue (fake memories are one thing, the nightmarish chorus of 'Apologise! Apologise! Apologise!' quite another) and the repeated motif of closed environments used by the Fullbringers (secret HQs, the dolls house, the virtual game world). Whether these are red herrings, some kind of subtext about how unreal home can seem after a prolonged experience of combat or an indication that all is not as it seems remains to be seen, but there's an enormous amount of thematic material pointing in that direction.

For all that it is worrying and potentially craptastic, hitting the reset button and down grading Ichigo back to confused teenager struggling with self and other needed to happen for the series to go anywhere after he maxed out. The Ichigo of the all-black-uber-bankai reached a peak of evolution along the lines of ultimate resolve. Not a lot of plot options with a young god-like being on your hands except  alienation from former nakama who can't relate any more. Thataway lies the path of super villain or outcast and Ichigo has always been a part of a nakama.

Strike that actually.  Going back to Seth's first fifty premise, Ichigo's problem in the first run through was not having a clearly defined nakama, With nothing to protect, no one to be alive for, and only guilt for having caused his mother's death he was sort of miserably lurking under bridges waiting for a chance to beat people up with Chad.

Good summary. Ichigo seems to have reverted to that earlier disposition, agreed, but at a lower ebb.

All this talk of closed worlds, dreams and illusions reminds me that we only have Aizen, Gin and Unohana's word for how Kyôka Suigetsu operates, that any one of them could be mistaken or lying, and that powerful Shinigami can operate their Zanpakuto's shikai without calling its name. If we need to have a Bobby Ewing moment then I'd prefer all of this to be taking place during Ichigo's fight with Aizen... but ultimately I don't really want this to be a dream, I want it integrated into the story in a way that's more satisfying than what we've had so far.

KT's pulled off some shit that I'm amazed at buying, so maybe...But in my heart of hearts I really would be ticked off with hand waving of some of this character development time. NO WANT LAME ORIHIME.

What needs to happen is Ichigo's break down again to a level that's on par with the nakama while renegotiating all those relationships and roles in new ways that fit the struggles of the past and doing so on the clock kicking ass against complex challengers.

Our boy has been spending too much time with non nakama and still having those original ties being strained. This works only if the alienation gets cranked up a few levels (hey look at who has the big bad's back in the end panel) and then snaps back with grand insight. We want our boy off center and reeling for the pay off of the recentering/reunion.  Distance makes the heart grow fonder and having Ichigo humbled and struggling is what keeps him an interesting main character. Cue Ishida having sussed the false memories out and busting in a wall.

We fear losing those closest to us. We fear losing our hard won strength and abilities.  We fear above all, everything we value being a lie including who we are. If that's Kyôka Suigetsu's ultimate bitch slap we still need a post Aizen reboot of a disempowered and alienated Ichigo to facilitate the circling evolution of intimate nakama relationship ties and complex self understanding.

For me, the lack of Rukia on screen highlights Ichigo's off centeredness from his true purpose and the stability of his self knowing. White Moon stabilizes the Black Sun not beacuse he is dependant on her but because as she has said before, her vision of who he is is absolute. This dynamic could also be deconstructed by KT but he's spent so much time building it up it would be a massive universe shift to destabilize it.

Not that we are going to get another one of these moments:

My preferred theory regarding Tsukishima's power is that he's removing memory blocks, not installing himself into people's memories. That would account for why he's got a different relationship with everyone (relative, friend, lover). There are precedents for Shinigami memory modifiers; perhaps someone (Urahara? Mayuri?) perfected the tech. Perhaps Tsukishima IS Ichigo's cousin, and Kubo's about to pull off a Dawn.

That might also explain taking Ishida out. If the Quincy in general, or Ishida specifically, had a different relationship with Tsukishima, one that it'd be unhelpful to restore immediately, then it's a good tactic to take him out early. As a separate group of superpowered humans the Fullbringers make natural rivals to the Quincy, rivals who may have evaded Soul Society's purge of powered humans through editing themselves out of history. They seem to be breaking a similar Soul Society taboo to the Vaizard, after all. Maybe Tsukishima is organising a human fightback against Soul Society and is the only one who kept his memories, as he needed to delete those of his comrades? Fear of extermination would be a good reason for them to want rid of their powers... maybe this is setting up more opposition to the Spirit King. With their complex histories and motivations the Shinigami make better story antagonists than any other faction.

Rukia was overheard defending Ichigo against accusations that he was doing something out of character... perhaps the charge is appearing to attack his friends? Agreed, Ichigo needs Rukia back to stabilise him, he seems pretty incapable of getting himself in order otherwise.

It'd also fit well with the overarching theme of Ichigo always being the last to know.

Maybe the Tsukishima/Ginjou antagonism has its roots in two different plans for how to evade extermination at the hands of the Shinigami? Whether to hide, depower or attack in kind?

Perhaps the previously poor memory alteration technology we've seen so far is deliberate misdirection so prevent people looking too closely at the veracity of their own memory? Discounting the possibility because they believe the tech is poor and unpredictable?

I'm curious if Fullbring is a newer human modification as a result of the Quincys being massacred? Filling the niche left open? The Shinigami seem to feel justified in killin 'em off but they may have been keeping a balance that's just not in Soul Society's tally.


i think this arc is a primer reset for a new version of the nakama dynamics before we start building up to the Spirit King. I do like the idea of Soul Society being out dated and in the role of problematic old school.

UNRESOLVED LIST:

Kurosaki <-> Shiba clan connection?
Beautiful Fighting Girls with Bankai
Orihime's modification
Isshin life pre 20 years ago (is a fan of bbq eel? Yes/no?)
Urahara's month long lock down in a magic bottle

What else?

Mayuri's spoils of war/imprisoned Arrancar
Renji's question to Urahara
Who/what are Division Zero and the Spirit King?

With so many built in questions available to explore I sincerely think the current arc is to consolidate and reposition the nakama. We need Ichigo a bit messed up to be able to relate to him.

Unless, yo, this *is* the reverse rescue mission but from the DID POV.

I'm not sure the nakama are that important. They act as co-ordinates through which characters are mapped and as drivers for storytelling, but beyond acting as points of contrast to show where/who Ichigo is, as background colour and as a catalyst to get a reaction from Strawberry I'm not sure we need to feel as though there's a core ensemble that has to be balanced. If there's an ensemble it's one of hundreds, not ten. I felt pretty invested in the idea of the nakama up to the point at which Ichigo and Unohana went to Fakekura... now I feel as though that unit has been left light years behind, outframed by Ichigo's family revelations, Chad's Fullbring allegiance and Ishida's absence. They feel fractured and faintly irrelevant now. Maybe that's the point, but I feel as though Kubo will have to make me care about them as a close-knit team again.

You guys might be able to help me out with the nuclear energy event we're running (Zone of Alienation, see the topic further down this forum). I'm looking to gather as many clips of apocalyptic explosions from anime as possible as a means of tracing Hiroshima imagery and nuclear themes throughout anime. Of course, Bleach has tons (I'm thinking specifically of Soi Fong's bankai), but anime in general is littered with similar. If you've got time to spare then it'd be really useful for me if you headed over to that other topic and mentioned where I might find good examples (preferably as decent subtitled avi files, and preferably with timing information so I'll know exactly where to go quickly to find the money shot).

*Rolling around on splash page in luscious color and missed friends*

456! Up!

Talk about waving a red flag in front of a bull. HOT DAMN, that's a dead call out to the core of what makes Ichigo himself, yes/no?

@Shin, where can I get me the art book?

XK said: HOT DAMN, that's a dead call out to the core of what makes Ichigo himself, yes/no?

Yes, that seems to be why he's freaking out more than we've ever seen.

Pah, looks like my Tsukishima speculation was way off-base. Not because we should be believing Tsukishima, but because I doubt Kubo would ever rewrite the canon to the extent that Tsukishima helped kick Aizen's ass and rescue Rukia.

Seth said: Not because we should be believing Tsukishima, but because I doubt Kubo would ever rewrite the canon to the extent that Tsukishima helped kick Aizen's ass and rescue Rukia.

Agreed, that has to be intentional teeth-on-edge for the readership set up of villainy right there.

@XK, It's not been fully scanlated yet - you can see a bit of it here. http://bleach.wikia.com/wiki/Bleach:_Official_Character_Book_3_UNMASKED
The stuff alleging Ulquiorra might not be dead is mainly hearsay, so full scanlations may prove what I've heard wrong.
Here's the main point of interest - the story of the secret past of everyone's favourite nihilist - *to music*! http://youtu.be/sVcZoSOaEqA
More fuel on the fire of the UlqiHime moe-industrial complex.
 (^ The above relates to a Twitter convo that XK and I had for people wondering WTF.)

SQUEEEEEEEEE!!!

UlqiHime moe-industrial complex has me now!

I will stop out of canon shipping in thread now, sorry. Ahem.


Right back to Ichigo getting called out on his self cosmology. The end o'chapter yelling about THIS NOT WHY I by both Chad and Ichigo has me thinking this is all super weird unless it is leveraging estrangements occurring off screen post Aizen-sealing. If the nakama was up at full health bar wouldn't everyone be like 'let us set arms aside and discuss Tsukishima-histories over tea and donuts'.

Yet that isn't what's up. Instead we have sad eyed Orihime willing to stand up to Ichigo (that's a thing right there to remark upon) and back-to-back pals now resentment fueled swinging at each other? This is more a floorshow of the time slip estrangement than just memory/history rewrite. Shit has completely fallen apart but needs to fall apart much much more.

As such, I'm leaning toward a rejection of Ichigo by Soul Society nakama and family estrangement. Go all the way and exile him completely cutting off or killing anyone that might lend a hand. Give us a mid powered Ichigo that must rescue himself from the cold cruel YOU IS CRAZY MURDERING NUTBAG OUTLAW by some sort of redemptive macguffin quest. I hate to say it, but I'm expecting even Rukia to say 'I don't know you anymore' because who Ichigo is as a  lonely-weirdo-outcast needs a full reboot along with his powers. Or conversely, that core cosmology needs redeeming into something else. My chips are on the former though. Still would like Ishida to break Kurosaki out through the wall and say "Go. Find the truth. I'll hold them off for as long as I can" because that would be WINSOME.

I'm figuring that this may be a ploy... that Ginjou and Tsukishima are in cahoots and this is part of the plan to restore his Shinigami abilities, by forcing him into a corner and pulling the drive to evolve/adapt out of him by any means necessary. The thing that counters that assumption is Ginjou not knowing anything about Tsukishima's ally, but that might just position Ginjou as being unwittingly working to the same objective as Tsukishima.

I think that it's worse than exposing the rifts that have developed amongst the Nakamakura: it's also exposed Ichigo's willingness to kill, which is how Orihime and Chad have come to take Tsukishima's side. Ichigo can't even rely on himself; somehow he has to remember that he's not a killer. I'd be upset if Ulquiorra turned out to be alive and that reveal caused Ichigo to remember himself. Even if the consequences were removed, he still committed the actions that led to the removed consequences and still dealt a death blow to Aizen, even if he didn't know Aizen would survive because of Hougyoku-powered high-speed regeneration. He still made all those post-Ulquiorra fight choices.

It has made me invested again while much of this arc has left me showing up just to keep up.

Wait, hasn't Ichigo always been wiling to kill non humans? Are we just discussing his acceptance of killling human Fullbringers?


If Tsukishima just has to stab a little bit (see: Orihime) why beat the snot out of Ishida? Why has he been taken off stage rather than just repositioned as Tsukishima's ally?

Seth said: I'd be upset if Ulquiorra turned out to be alive and that reveal caused Ichigo to

..and what if Ulquiorra isn't in this phase of the current arc or in it at all? Will you still feel cheated if he isn't staked down?

And what's with that phone conversation Tsukishima had with Orihime a couple of chapters ago? "Oh come on, I met you just the other day."

http://mangastream.com/read/bleach/46888961/10

Does Tsukishima's ability require a certain proximity?

Tomorrow is Ichigo's birthday and the twitterverse is exploding with anniversary posts:

http://www.j-bleach.com/harajuku/mainhall.html

AW.

Ichigo was always up for redeeming/condemning Hollows... however, he proved surprisingly squeamish about killing Arrancar. Kubo's cosmology was never too clear on whether soul burial rites extended to Arrancar (there was some dialogue that hinted that maybe it didn't, but I can't think where I'd source that at the moment. He spared Dordonni and Grimmjow, even saved the latter from Nnoitra. The turning point was in his fight with Ulquiorra, when Ishida tried to reason with Hollow Ichigo to prevent him from killing his opponent. After that, Ichigo's attitude seemed to change... he went straight for Yammi's neck, then straight for Aizen's neck. So yeah, I can't see any way around there being a definite turning point during the Ulquiorra fight.

To clarify: I don't really care whether Ulquiorra is alive or dead, I care about Ichigo having a trite psychic rehabilitation merely on the basis of being robbed of the consequences of his actions. That happened in a recent series I watched: a character who was morally against killing lost her composure and delivered what she intended to be a killing stroke, agonised over it when she came to her sense, then stopped caring when she was later told that she missed and that the guy escaped virtually unharmed. Piss poor writing, I just don't want a repeat of that here.

Liger: don't have unrestricted internet, can't check the link.

For Seth:

Grr. Cannot post.

Ah! Bug sorted.

Good call regarding that phone call. Yeah, I'm joining the bet that's saying Tsukishima's powers are proximity-related.

So maybe that's the key to defeating Tsukishima. All it would take is for Ichigo to use his head and remember that call.

Hmmm... I'm now wondering whether there was a translation mess-up on those pages.  "Orihime?  It's me... yes, Tsukihima" doesn't seem to fit with "What are you saying?  We met just the other day."  The first part implies that Orihime has correctly identified him, and that he's confirming.  The second part implies that he's reminding her who he is.  I'm not sure those two lines tie together, so I'm wondering whether one is incorrect.

Do we have a link to a raw version? It could be as simple as adding a "yeah" where there shouldn't be one. My Japanese is extremely limited, but I should be able to spot that much.

Cool, that'd be useful.  And no, I don't have a link... I wouldn't even know where to go to find a raw.

They're surprisingly hard to find. I'm trying to scare one up right now.

I tried to embed images, but things got all wonky, so I linked them instead.

In panel five we have the word "so," (そう)which is a confirming　thing, like a "that's right"  

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y43/demonize/Bleach45308.jpg

Now here is where gets tricky, as short forms are my Achilles's heel. But in panel one I recognize the kanji for "what"(何) "say"(言) "you"(君) and "meet"(会)　as well as the hirigana for "recently" (こないだ).

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y43/demonize/Bleach45309.jpg

So I guess we're back to square one. But it's not out of character for Orihime to be all "Oh it's you!" as though she recognizes the person at first even though she doesn't.

<One asks a Trustee/Editor as deleting comments rather than editing on the board has some conditions as not to break the database.>

Tsukihima's ability also seems to have some sort of time to kick in period? It's not instantaneous?

@Liger LOOK AT YOU WITH YOUR MAD SKILLZ! Very proud of your hard work, lady.

The flashy birthdayness was getting to me.

Off main manga topic but I call Bleach holiday shenanigans.

I wonder what it would be like to have a job with live action anime hair?

It certainly seems to have taken time to kick in Chad and Orihime, but what about the others? At what point did he co-opt the other Fullbringers?

What do you folks think about the Fullbringers and the addition of more Bleach factions with non human abilities? Does it seem to fit as it leverages existing character abilities or does it seem strained?